 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
History Forum / General / Ancient History / July 2009Kartan stone tools add to evidence of ancient phonetician mining activity in South Australia 3200 years ago
The Bronze age collapse of 1300 BC was almost certainly caused by the ending of tin and gold mining that ceased at the same time in South Australia IMHO Robert Drews describes the collapse as "the worst disaster in ancient history, even more calamitous than the collapse of the Western Roman Empire".[4] A number of people have spoken of the cultural memories of the disaster as stories of a "lost golden age". Hesiod for example spoke of Ages of Gold, Silver and Bronze, separated from the modern harsh cruel world of the Age of Iron by the Age of Heroes. [edit] Nature and causes of destruction As part of the Late Bronze Age-Early Iron Age Dark Ages, it was a period associated with the collapse of central authorities, a general depopulation, particularly of highly urban areas, the loss of literacy in Anatolia and the Aegean, and its restriction elsewhere, the disappearance of established patterns of long-distance international trade, increasingly vicious intra-elite struggles for power, and reduced options for the elite if not for the general mass of population. There are various theories put forward to explain the situation of collapse, many of them compatible with each other. seems some local war against the Phoenetians in 1300 BC , cut of trade , including with South Australian vast tin and gold mines Even though the Egyptian Turin Papyrus gold mine map showed the layout of the South Australian mine , clearly those who knew where the mines were must have all been killed and mining ceased once regular buyers stopped calling 3200 years ago , creating the need for the iron age once all available Bronze and gold reserved were plundered the ancient world imploded for centuries Clearly the Phoenician miners / traders who left old iron tool andred / purple leather , behind were using local native peoples to pound the rocks to extract the gold and tin from the vast mining areas in South Australia around the Lower Lakes and nearby areas http://picasaweb.google.com/kangarooistan9/KangarooistanOldIronToolProofTurinPap yrusGoldMineIsInSouthAustraliaTestImages# http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dcgk9t7p_6hm5bqkfc&hl=en the evidence of vast Phoenician mining activity in South Australia is so over whelming its really quite amazing to see experts still demanding more evidence , while happily accepting a tooth evidence of an entire breed of animal or human presence , or a single reference in the bible or ancient poem as evidence of entire civilizations http://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=dcgk9t7p_12g2xp5tdk&hl=en KANGAROO ISLAND - AN ARCHAEOLOGICAL MYSTERY When Europeans first saw Kangaroo Island it was uninhabited. Mainland Aborigines called it 'Karta' - Land of the Dead. We now know that Aborigines had lived on the island until at least 4,000 years ago - long after the island was isolated from the mainland by rising sea levels. Who were the Aborigines of Kangaroo Island? Who else are called Kartan people or Martu people or Per Amun People http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kartan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peramangk http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaurna Three types of large stone tools found on the island: a hammerstone, 'horsehoof' core, and pebble chopper. After their discovery in the 1930s these large tools became known as 'Kartan implements' - based on the Ramindjeri word 'Karta' for Kangaroo Island. Collectors H. Cooper, N.B. Tindale, 1930s, (A2244, A20420, A30163). The Continuing Mystery Archaeologists are continuing to uncover new evidence. For example, examination of pollen spores from ancient bushfires suggests that Aborigines may have been living on the island until only 2,000 years ago. The fate of the Kangaroo Island Aborigines is still a mystery. If they left the Island, why and how did they leave? If they remained, what became of them? http://books.google.com.au/books?id=wlg8lX6dmM8C&pg=PA69&lpg=PA69&dq=kartan&sour ce=bl&ots=2i66ngr-9q&sig=jun_QHnbm9yYAmyVRKarTGlJs1A&hl=en&ei=zTRKSsPICpOuMMqpib MK&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9 http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:off icial&um=1&q=horsehoof%20cores%20kartan%20stone%20tools&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw Did you mean: horse hoof cores kartan stone tools Search Results Results include your SearchWiki notes for horsehoof cores kartan stone tools. Share these notes Copy and paste this link into an email or IM: See a preview of the shared page 1. Aboriginal environmental impacts - Google Books Result by James L. Kohen - 1995 - Science - 160 pages The distinction between Kartan and core tool and scraper horsehoof cores is based largely on size ... used which required stone tools for their manufacture. ... books.google.com.au/books?isbn=0868403016... - 2. [PDF] Australian Archaeology File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML the early stone industry is known as the Kartan. Presumably .... for Edeowie Creek with core tools of the horsehoof series, flake ... dspace.flinders.edu.au/dspace/.../ 788/.../1980010011020_FINAL.pdf - Similar - by RJ Lampert - 1980 - Cited by 4 - Related articles - All 2 versions 3. [PDF] Australian Archaeology File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML with the calcareous Upper Mungo Unit, from a few stone tools ... heavy core scrapers of horsehoof type. I saw none of the small tools such as tulas and ... heavy core tools means that it is clearly not Kartan as Cooper ... dspace.flinders.edu.au/dspace/.../ 339/.../1976005012014_FINAL.pdf - Similar - by RJ Lampert - 1976 - Related articles - All 2 versions More results from dspace.flinders.edu.au » 4. Ngurunderi - Section 6 - 9:20am Mainland Aborigines called it 'Karta' - Land of the Dead. ... Three types of large stone tools found on the island: a hammerstone, 'horsehoof' core, ... www.samuseum.sa.gov.au/ngurunderi/ng9htm.htm - Cached - Similar - 5. Run Search Home Page News What to See Events Information Tours ... A 'Kartan' chopper or core, with an anvil pit. Collected from the Hawks Nest site, ... On the basis of the distinctive 'horsehoof' stone tools found on ... www.samuseum.sa.gov.au/page/default.asp?site=1&id... - Cached - Similar - 6. Prehistory of Australia - Google Books Result by Derek John Mulvaney, Johan Kamminga - 1999 - Social Science - 480 pages They distinguished four main tool types: blocky, horsehoof- shaped cores, ... and Tindale's Kartan sites in coastal South Australia, which at that time were ... books.google.com.au/books?isbn=1864489502... - 7. INVESTIGATOR GROUP EXPEDITION 2006: TWO STONE IMPLEMENTS FROM ... 'Two 'horsehoof cores of Kartan proportions'and 50 smaller flakes 'mostly of fine- .... also offered no more than a few stone tools. ... www.ingentaconnect.com/content/rssa/trssa/2008/.../art00002?... - Similar - by K Walshe - 2008 - Cited by 1 8. [RTF] ___Sent by Betty from Wales on 17 September 2002. This is the one ... File Format: Rich Text Format - View as HTML 17 Sep 2002 ... These consisted of heavy, domed, horse-hoof shaped core tools and scrapers with ... very large horse hoof cores and pebble choppers called Kartan industry by .... His tools of stone and bone, were typical of the Late ... www1.aiatsis.gov.au/exhibitions/wentworth/a334583_a.rtf - Similar - 9. Encyclopedic dictionary of archaeology - Google Books Result by Barbara Ann Kipfer - 2000 - Social Science - 708 pages Kartan culture: A group of stone assemblages with heavy core tools found on ... waisted ax blades, and large horsehoof cores (mean weights of 500 g), ... books.google.com.au/books?isbn=0306461587... - 10. THE FIFTH CONTINENT: PROBLEMS CONCERNING THE HUMAN COLONIZATION OF ... of stone tools such as horse-hoof cores, steep-edged and notched scrapers, .... of the typologically archaic Kartan industry indicate a much higher an ... arjournals.annualreviews.org/doi/.../annurev.an.08.100179.002305 - Similar - by R Jones - 1979 - Cited by 27 - Related articles - All 4 versions Did you mean to search for: horse hoof cores kartan stone tools > The Bronze age collapse of 1300 BC was almost certainly caused by the > ending of tin and gold mining that ceased at the same time in South > Australia IMHO (snip) As I've said elsewhere, a good theory is one that can be falsified but has not yet been falsified. Although not all good theories should be given equal credibility (theories should be ranked according to their merits according to Occam's Razor), all good theories should be considered until such time as they cease to be good theories. Although I'm not convinced that Europe was impacted by events in South Australia in 1300 BC, and regard claims that the link is "almost certain" as a stretch, it's certainly falsifiable and I know of no actual falsification of it. Ergo, it is a good theory. It's reasonably simple, so is of at least moderately high merit according to William of Okkam's famous dictum. The maps that purport to show Australian mines are not, in themselves, compelling. Worse, since they are part of the basis for the theory, they cannot be used to support the theory. That would be circular logic. I therefore propose a different test. There are many Aboriginal languages in Australia, though sadly over half of them have been completely destroyed and less than a third of the remainder have any significant number of speakers. However, quite a bit of information does exist even on the two-thirds that are not extinct but are critically endangered. http://www.dnathan.com/VL/austLang.htm What we are looking for are Indo-European, pre-Indo-European OR Canaanite root words present in Aboriginal languages such that the ancient European root words are CLOSER to what is present in the Aboriginal languages than any modern Indo-European OR modern Semitic equivalent. In other words, we want to falsify the theory that the Aboriginal languages have no contamination, AND falsify the theory that all contamination is modern. Language is good because physical evidence is impermanent and can't be relied upon to be present, whereas loan-words are absolutely guaranteed to be present where two mutually unintelligible languages and mutually incompatible cultures attempt trade. A common frame of reference will be invented and as there is (by definition) nothing in the language that can describe it, words will be borrowed to fill in the gap. There will be other tests that are perfectly good and non-circular. I'm sure kangarooistan can think of a dozen without blinking. The challenge is not so much whether someone can come up with a good test, but rather what the test concludes. On Jun 30, 11:46 am, kangarooistan <kangarooist...@gmail.com> wrote: > The Bronze age collapse of 1300 BC was almost certainly caused by the > ending of tin and gold mining that ceased at the same time in South > Australia IMHO (snip) As I've said elsewhere, a good theory is one that can be falsified but has not yet been falsified. Although not all good theories should be given equal credibility (theories should be ranked according to their merits according to Occam's Razor), all good theories should be considered until such time as they cease to be good theories. Although I'm not convinced that Europe was impacted by events in South Australia in 1300 BC, and regard claims that the link is "almost certain" as a stretch, it's certainly falsifiable and I know of no actual falsification of it. Ergo, it is a good theory. It's reasonably simple, so is of at least moderately high merit according to William of Okkam's famous dictum. The maps that purport to show Australian mines are not, in themselves, compelling. Worse, since they are part of the basis for the theory, they cannot be used to support the theory. That would be circular logic. I therefore propose a different test. There are many Aboriginal languages in Australia, though sadly over half of them have been completely destroyed and less than a third of the remainder have any significant number of speakers. However, quite a bit of information does exist even on the two-thirds that are not extinct but are critically endangered. http://www.dnathan.com/VL/austLang.htm What we are looking for are Indo-European, pre-Indo-European OR Canaanite root words present in Aboriginal languages such that the ancient European root words are CLOSER to what is present in the Aboriginal languages than any modern Indo-European OR modern Semitic equivalent. In other words, we want to falsify the theory that the Aboriginal languages have no contamination, AND falsify the theory that all contamination is modern. Language is good because physical evidence is impermanent and can't be relied upon to be present, whereas loan-words are absolutely guaranteed to be present where two mutually unintelligible languages and mutually incompatible cultures attempt trade. A common frame of reference will be invented and as there is (by definition) nothing in the language that can describe it, words will be borrowed to fill in the gap. There will be other tests that are perfectly good and non-circular. I'm sure kangarooistan can think of a dozen without blinking. The challenge is not so much whether someone can come up with a good test, but rather what the test concludes. Do any of the native languages even contain a word for gold or any other metal? Be careful here. Don't except "words" that amount to, "What is this?" > Do any of the native languages even contain a word for gold or any other > metal? Be careful here. Don't except "words" that amount to, "What is this?" I honestly don't know, but those words would be good, along with words for anything Phoenicians are supposed to have introduced into the country, or which would be implicit by the Phoenicians being there. (Technology the Phoenicians used, for example, or words used to describe anything ceremonial or religious in nature, as there would be no prior-existing native word to describe something the natives had never encountered.) The null hypothesis, as I said, is that there was no contamination from Europe or the Middle East and no contact. We can't ever prove this to be the case, we can only disprove it. (In fact, you can never ultimately prove anything, the best you can ever do is show that you can have a certain level of confidence that something is true. However, you can always disprove anything, since all claims have a corresponding null hypothesis and you can disprove a null hypothesis.) > I honestly don't know, This fact has yet to so much as slow you down, never mind stopping you from posting on every topic under the sun. > > I honestly don't know, > > This fact has yet to so much as slow you down, > never mind stopping you from posting on every > topic under the sun. The more you know, the more you know about what you don't know. Only the ignorant have nothing left to learn. > The more you know, the more you know > about what you don't know. Well, in that case, there's yet another dilemma that you'll never face... > "imipak" <imi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > Do any of the native languages even contain a word for gold or any other > metal? Be careful here. Don't except "words" that amount to, "What is this?" The Native languages are pregnant with words that seem very close to the ancient Aramaic tongues , many words still carry through in both languages we all know there were no real maps of Australia until very recently , so its safe to assume no recent visitors pre white settlement 1616 i think is the first map of south Australia coast The native people dont have any knowledge of gold or TIN or Murex Purple All of which they trade with the Phoenician traders in vast quantities , mainly tin . black sand This tricked me for a while but the Native people did trade widely with ground rock ochres as paint , the same method used to mine the gold ,kartan tools = heavy pounder stones Looks like the same grinding method was used to pound quartz and the gold was then refined in the gold refinery marked on the Ti n Papyrus map , leaving powdered quartz / 1000s tons at site marked as the refinery The miners would never have been able to own or hold or trade gold , gold all belonged to the king , ordinary people would have no use for it and miners would be killed if they were found with any yellow stuff , no shops or other buyers either It all belonged to GOD , the sun GOD Tin as heavy black sand was easily washed from the beaches and murex snails were of little value to native peoples who once again would be forbidden to own ROYAL purple or gold Its my bet the Phoenicians traded opium for black sand and yellow sand with very happy little brown people who were very very happy to do business with their two mates who may only have called in once or twice a year , for several thousand years to load up the gold dust and black sand on the return trip via the spice Islands ,assuming few ever made the entire round trip , but SOMEBODY mined gold and tin on a VAST scale They DID leave behind language , and DNA , and myths , and KARTAN TOOLS and the old iron tool of my earlier messages English written recorded some words but these are of NIL reliability Many experts visited a single person with a translator from other tribes and the person recording what he hears was German Scottish and even polish , and the written record is in nead of a careful examination several different researchers in the same tribe recorded much difference and many different spellings There are under lying signs though ,as all Arabic people who visit the subject seem to spot he very GREAT similarities Often its impossible to tell Palestinians from the local Aboriginal people until they speak They LOOK IDENTICAL, similar hair too , and build and dark brown / green eyes , while not evidence its interesting , there is no fuzzy hair nor Asian appearance , they were once classed as Australoids , they do have many similarities genetically , and Linguistically , and they do have birds that talk to then [ speak language / communicate } > > "imipak" <imi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > > Do any of the native languages even contain a word for gold or any other [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the ancient Aramaic tongues , many words still carry through in both > languages (snip) I'm snipping here because although the rest of the post is extremely interesting, this is the pertinent part as far as my reply here goes. I'll certainly check the languages you name in your prior post, and will also check what you say here, but I wanted to thank you for posting precisely the sort of information I was looking for. The reason the maps can't be used to prove the theory is that the maps were used to come up with the theory in the first place. In scientific investigations, one given piece of data can be used only once. That does not mean the maps are useless for investigation purposes - archaeological digs conducted where the maps indicate something should be found would be new data points and therefore could be used to verify the theory. It's a little cumbersome, but in general it proves to be a good way to do things. Now, what you say about languages is extremely significant. I'm sure you've seen enough of my posts to know I like to check things before going along with them, but I can say this much: even a handful of loan- words from Canaanite or Phoenician being present in even a single Native Australian language would be enough to establish that said Native Australians had contact with people from that region. If there are even a tiny fraction of the number of loan-words you're talking about, you have successfully falsified the null hypothesis that there were no trading links, and (by implication) have established a very firm basis for saying that your theory is the simplest theory that explains all the known facts, and is therefore the best theory. To answer your earlier question, yes, I'm familiar with the Bronze Age collapses and the various related searches for metals. Britain had been a net exporter of metals from the discovery of smelting -- copper, tin and gold being the three major exports. As a result, a lot of the archaeology I've mostly focused on has been heavily influenced by the demands for these metals across Europe. > > > "imipak" <imi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > > > Do any of the native languages even contain a word for gold or any other > > > metal? Be careful here. Don't except "words" that amount to, "What is this?" The Native languages are pregnant with words that seem very close to the ancient Aramaic tongues , many words still carry through in both the Arabic and Aboriginal languages , the original Aramaic languages are mixed up now in many middle eastern languages , but I know some Arabic And there are thousands of Aboriginal words that beg he question , WHY so similar words and the unusual use of certain sounds , not seen in english but easy for arabs to pronounce the T = Dj and silent g gk long long Marreee for english Mary in no particular order but a few Aboriginal words I know have middle eastern equivalents Whyalla Beltana Marree Mallala Murri Arabunna Jarrah Tintinara If you get a very very detailed map of Australia and look at the local names of tiny towns and areas of the landscape they more often are named by the local aboriginal peoples of that area ,as best as the locals could translate them there are many good ones mate , I have a 1906 paper version I mark with colour pens to create my own to identify patterns , not seen by others , so I dont bother with the online maps , you can assume words starting with or ending with A , can be the same as words starting or ending in AH or AR http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/historical/australia_1916_south_australia.jpg Arabunna Arabanna Anna creek Arkaroola Anangu 1000s upon 1000s of words with big question marks , but uncanny similarities once you hear "Arabic ? " in native Aboriginal speakers you find them in clusters , but you can trace them all back to Peramungk as HQ in the ancient mining culture , NOT coming down from the North as many claim but up from the SOUTH , even the introduction and use of Boomerangs ENTERED AUSTRALIA from the south IMHO , the northern tribes NEVER ever made or used Boomerangs http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Australia_Boomerang_Distribution.PNG the oldest boomerangs are found buried in swamps near potential coastal tin mine sites near the southern coast Then there is a BIG question re the so called " chinamans well " on the isolated coast in an area know to local tribes as "Tintinara" , ancient stranded beaches from long ago Murray mouth /beach sands ,pre european but not chinese http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tintinara http://www.planbooktravel.com.au/region-images/SA/limestone-coast/limestone-coas t-400x272/chinamans-well.jpg/view there was no other water for miles when summer arrived it was time to move on , in very early contact white people named big mountains after white people, but as settlers moved in the locals simply adopted the local aboriginal names as well as local Aboriginals labour from the area , who all new the names my point being good local; maps probably are better that an EXPERT who passed through the area in 1800s on horseback with a black person who knew someone , ,as a translator recorded what he thought the locals said , in spelling HE WAS VERY happy with , but now we at times get this offered up as local words ever as an Authority on Aboriginal words , , its pathetic mate Grab a very very good paper map , some very early maps had heaps and heaps more names and detail gathered by early map makers who at least walked every inch , WITH native help , employed locally to help , but as nothing was ever done in that area it is now no longer on modern maps Mark names of possible interest NOTICE A PATTERN ?? Notice a pattern of Kartan tools http://docs.google.com/View?id=dcgk9t7p_39g56bfkf4 notice a pattern of recent copper gold tin recent European mining ,indicate what minerals are they mining ???? You can google South Australian maps, i know and have hard copies 100 years old , and my family lived and worked in south Australia mate , as you know on the ground every thing becomes much clearer , especially after 50 years on your hands and knees scratching your head at what the EXPERTS books all say cannot be true , cos somebody in the 1800s said so and nobody ever questioned the EXPERT Educated white explorers know FAR more than locals we only need ask Burke and wills to prove that , local natives walked coast to coast every year of their lives , as fact later explorers learned to understand , they KNEW every sq inch of the country , I was quite surprised once I started learning Arabic to notice the word and language is unmistakably related There you will find thousands of Phoenician words Older maps and native peoples were restricted by distance to water , and adjusting for this , its possible to trace the number of possible " phoenetian " names on a paper map a patern soon emerges mount Barker was HQ The Turin papyrus has hieroglyphs on it that can easily be translated as Per Amun Ngk Peramangk Map out their occurrence to PROVE they were coming from MOUNT BARKER in south Australia will these a port in what is now Milang [ an Phoenician word ?] > (snip) > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > will also check what you say here, but I wanted to thank you for > posting precisely the sort of information I was looking for. . > The reason the maps can't be used to prove the theory is that the maps > were used to come up with the theory in the first place. In scientific [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > verify the theory. It's a little cumbersome, but in general it proves > to be a good way to do things. re the maps , the Turin papyrus is "100 pieces of evidence" of an eye witness mate You best books in a library if you want to exclude all reference to the map Even the ochres on the map are from South Australian mine site IMHO I have located the exact spot to map maker was standing when he made the 360% map of the site , exactly as he saw it in the exact colour and exact proportions , 30 feet up a tower , I can locate WHERE he was standing EXACTLY , 3200 years ago , here in south Australia The maps are STUFFED WITH HARD EVIDENCE , for anybody to check probable the closest thing to ancient Phonetician spoken language will be found in local Aboriginal tribes, almost unadulterated pre 1830 Note the Murray River Peoples were different and only little contact was made between the Peramangk Peoples , even though they shared some country , the central Peramangk territory was where the gold mine was HIDDEN and guarded like fingerprints , the closer you examine a genuine print he greater the certainty there is NIL doubt 100% exact in every respect =================================================== its Easy to read "The house of Amun / people" written on the papyrus / " Per Amun Peoples " as Peramangk the name of the local peoples used by adjoining tribes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peramangk ===================================================== Mount barker over looks the entire region of the mining activity and was clearly sending and receiving smoke signals from the other mountains seen in the areas was a common practiced among Aboriginal peoples , smoke was used to warn and send messages until very very recent times , lookouts old men watched for the big smokes Table 1: Translations of the hieratic texts on the map side of the Turin papyrus (adapted from Harrell and Brown 1992: Table 1) ______________________________________________________________ Text Number1 Translation 1 the road that leads to the sea 2 another road that leads to the sea 3 the road of Tent-p-mer [the translation of the last word is uncertain – it may be the name of an unknown locality or it may mean ‘treasurer’ or ‘harbor’] 4 mountains of gold 5 mountains of gold 6 the houses of the gold-working settlement 7 cistern [or ‘water reservoir’; the text is written on top of the water sign] 8 stela of Menma’atre, life, health and prosperity! [king Sety I, 1290-1279 BC, of the New Kingdom’s 19th Dynasty]2 9 the road of Ta-menti [the last word is apparently the name of an unknown locality] 10 the shrine of Amun of the pure mountain 11 the mountains in which gold is worked, they are colored pink 12 mountains of gold and silver [or perhaps ‘mountains of electrum’, where electrum is a natural mixture of gold and silver] 13 …the hill of Amun 14 the hill where Amun rests 15 [not translatable; appears to be part of a name for some locality] 16 [too fragmentary to translate, but it appears to be comments on travel from one unnamed locality to another; a travel time of ‘one day’ and ‘gold’ are mentioned] 16’ mountains of gold [appears to be a continuation of 16 but is a separate text] 17 distance from the gold-working settlement to the mountain of bekheny,…khet [this text is repeated three times, apparently for emphasis; the distance in units of khet is missing]3,4 http://www.eeescience.utoledo.edu/Faculty/Harrell/Egypt/Turin%20Papyrus/Harrell_ Papyrus_Map_table-1.htm > Now, what you say about languages is extremely significant. I'm sure > you've seen enough of my posts to know I like to check things before [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > firm basis for saying that your theory is the simplest theory that > explains all the known facts, and is therefore the best theory. the local Aboriginal languages are probably the most pristine Phoenetian speakers on earth , stuck in a time capsule for 3200 years , totally isolated, after well over 1000 years of endless contact and a million tons of TIN ore shipped and over 3 million tons of Quartz rock pounded to powder , and supplying well over 90% of the Murex Snails for over 1000 years to make the famous tyrian purple , ALL from south Australia > To answer your earlier question, yes, I'm familiar with the Bronze Age > collapses and the various related searches for metals. Britain had > been a net exporter of metals from the discovery of smelting -- > copper, tin and gold being the three major exports. As a result, a lot > of the archaeology I've mostly focused on has been heavily influenced > by the demands for these metals across Europe. If you know anything at all about ancient mining , you will have surely noticed the size of the British mines could never supply more than 10% of the demand for TIN The Phoenetians shipped most gold and tin in from the EAST Nobody ever cracked their trade secrets How to make tyrian purple Where was King Solomons Mine Where was the Turin Papyrusmine All died out in one dumb move when some greedy bastard thought hecould steal the wealth from the Phoenicians instead of buying it from them The absence of new gold and tin slowly sent the Ancient world into terminal decline once they lost the South australia minerals and slowly recycled the stored wealth until they had destroyed all stored wealth tying o seal it rather than create more new wealth they consumed the wealth stored up in the first2000 years in wars If you understan how tin / black sand can be had very easilyfrom ancient beach sands and you can find an ancient beach that has not yet been mined you can ALWAYS getblack sand / tin UNLESS somebody already mined it 3500 years of river running for up to 20 million years + a vast vast amount of easy TIN , that built the ancient empires iof Egypt and Phonetician NOT the tiny mines seen in brittain , that Romans were forced to rely on once Phonetician shipping was destroyed The south Australian black / tin HMS , sand mines were 1000 times more profitable Where on this map would you expect the phoneticians to have mined TIN Where on earth could you find a better TIN trap , like a giant natural sluice with the tin siting in to bottom few riffles waiting to be loaded onto boats by the millions of tons Where on EARTH can you find a better place to farm Murex Snails EXACTLY where they found the tin , a NATURAL home of Murex snails 1000 times more plentiful than in the Mediterranean , thats WHY nobody since was able to gather enough Murex Snails from the Mediterranean , Phonetician got Aboriginals to AUSTRALIA , actually in the gulf nearby mostly , but also in the mined out Lakes and coorong after mines extracted the black sand / tin http://images.google.com.au/imgres?imgurl=http://assets.panda.org/img/original/m urray_darling.gif&imgrefurl=http://wwf.panda.org/about_our_earth/about_freshwate r/freshwater_problems/river_decline/10_rivers_risk/murray_darling/&usg=__nUZU3GA t7YSb-3Vmm-Ut6q5TAFg=&h=774&w=655&sz=41&hl=en&start=6&sig2=zF3ebqVdnqPe0VfRaW2cF w&um=1&tbnid=Hj0marHoFoqeNM:&tbnh=142&tbnw=120&prev=/images%3Fq%3DMurray%2Bdarli ng%2Briver%2Bsystem%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26channel%3Ds%26rls%3Dorg.moz illa:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1&ei=IhBMSp22EOHcmQemyvgI kanga ======= > On Jun 30, 11:46 am, kangarooistan <kangarooist...@gmail.com> wrote:> The Bronze age collapse of 1300 BC was almost certainly caused by the > > ending of tin and gold mining that ceased at the same time in South [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > merits according to Occam's Razor), all good theories should be > considered until such time as they cease to be good theories. . > Although I'm not convinced that Europe was impacted by events in South > Australia in 1300 BC, and regard claims that the link is "almost > certain" as a stretch, it's certainly falsifiable and I know of no > actual falsification of it. Ergo, it is a good theory. It's reasonably > simple, so is of at least moderately high merit according to William > of Okkam's famous dictum. Areyou familiar with the Bronze Age Collapes And the probability it was caused by or led to a shortage of bronze and eventually led to beginning of the iron age This IMPACTED Europe South Australia was being mined for TIN at that time The biggest TIN mine ever was where we now see the Coorong and Lower Murray Lakes > The maps that purport to show Australian mines are not, in themselves, > compelling. Worse, since they are part of the basis for the theory, > they cannot be used to support the theory. That would be circular > logic. You mean we may NOT use the site to prove the case And HOW do we locate the site without MAPS ?? How can we identify exactly the area to people who dont know where south Australia is , or those few who may be interested to do follow up research The Subject can not be proven online with pictures It takes EYE witness observations to provide PROOF Only those who have seen the evidence can really form an informed opinion > I therefore propose a different test. There are many Aboriginal > languages in Australia, though sadly over half of them have been > completely destroyed and less than a third of the remainder have any > significant number of speakers. However, quite a bit of information > does exist even on the two-thirds that are not extinct but are > critically endangered. the Languages in the Area are FULL OF WORDS if you examine the links provided to the Peramangk , Kaurna and Martu peoples , even their NAMES are from known middle eastern languages as are most of their culture 3200 years ago mine workers > http://www.dnathan.com/VL/austLang.htm > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Aboriginal languages have no contamination, AND falsify the theory > that all contamination is modern. Try Per Amun ngk Peramangk , Martu , Kaurna , Kartan , the 4 tribes nearest ALL straight from ancient Phoenetian Aramaic tounges > Language is good because physical evidence is impermanent and can't be > relied upon to be present, whereas loan-words are absolutely [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > the language that can describe it, words will be borrowed to fill in > the gap. You mean like EMU Anangu Martu Murri I suspect the local Aboriginals speak almost pure ancient Phoenetian better that people in the middle east They were isolated after the 3200 yer ago Bronze Age Collapse , and retained unadulterated language more so than those in the middle east have Even the myths can be very interesting when examined carefully The Minka bird of peramangk peoples is similar to the Hoopee bird of Solomon Speaking the language of the birds / reading their signals do tell native people HEAPS Indeed thats HOW the ancient Phoenetians themselves" discovered " the place , by following the birds that were eating their Murexs nails to see where they went each winter the Phoenetians / aboriginals also supplied most of the worlds demand for Murex Purple from the coast of South Australia for over 2000years according tothe deposition rates of their middens , starting about 4000 years ago and ending abruptly 3200 years ago after mining a million ton of TIN / black sand , 100 times more than the tiny mines in the UK ,that any geologistscouldtell you could only ever supply 10% of the tin used in the anciebt world The Islamic scripture record a river of bronze flowing into King Sulimam / solomon > There will be other tests that are perfectly good and non-circular. > I'm sure kangarooistan can think of a dozen without blinking. The > challenge is not so much whether someone can come up with a good test, > but rather what the test concludes. yes mate after50 years of part time reaearch kanga has many many points to raise if required IF you do haveany PROOF Im wrong please let me know mate Because every time I test any area it not only stands but ADDs to the ever expanding mountain of FACTS there isno other Archaeological sie fromthat era that is so complete and so pristine , the sites the anguage theanimalsthe plants the insects everything was stuck into the 32000 years old time warp What more could we dream of mate the evidence is not only over whelming its unadulterated execpt for less than last 200 years at the surface HEAPS of stuff totally untouched and STILL western white capitalists refuse to make the one step outside their self created reality prison The size of the mines is vast , but so were the Pyramids that a few centuries ago would have been LAUGHED at by people who had only read of them less than 100 years ago mate they had not yet found Tutankhamen Tomb WHy are we so surprised totally unimaginable finds await us all The Turin Papyrus map is the mine in South Australia ANYBODY with a copy of he map could use it to navigate the site Like a fingerprint EXACT FIT , only those not interested to actually do the hard bits can KNOW its and exact fit , until somebody else has proven the fit the experts wont leave their offices to claim the glory and strut the site with pride explaining his find to the world media, it is simply a matter of time till some expert actually does what he was paid for decades to do we all know who found the DSS dont we mate , and we all remember how he never got a second mention once he delivered the evidence to the experts kanga ===== Hi Imipak a new postI recently put together mate , for your information , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Per_(hieroglyph) Pr (hieroglyph) (Redirected from Per (hieroglyph)) House( " floor plan " )in hieroglyphs O1 Pr is the hieroglyph for 'house', the floor-plan of a walled building with an open doorway. Though its original pronunciation is unknown, modern egyptology assigns it the value of Per. Pr combined with an associated "personal name", god, or location becomes the "House of .... ." An example for pharaoh Setnakhte is the city of: Pr-Atum, (city of Pithom). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peramangk Peramangk From Wikipedia, The Per amu ngk / Preamangk are an Indigenous Australian people whose traditional lands are primarily located in Adelaide Hills but also in the southern stretches of the Fleurieu Peninsula, South Australia. They were also referred to as the Mount Barker tribe, as their numbers were noted to be greater around the Mount Barker summit[1] Martu Martu may refer to * an ancient Middle Eastern people; see Amorite. * the deity they worshipped; see Amurru. * a Sumerian god; see Martu * an Australian Aboriginal people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martu Kaurna The Kaurna (pronounced "Gaa-nah") people are a group of Indigenous Australians whose traditional lands lie in and around the Adelaide Plains of South Australia. Kaurna language is the spoken language of the Kaurna people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaurna Canaan (Phoenician: כנענ, Kana'n, Hebrew: כנען kna-an, Arabic: كنعان Kanaʿān) is an ancient term for a region encompassing modern-day Israel and Lebanon, the Palestinian Territories, plus adjoining coastal lands http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canaan Where was Hatshepsuts "green gold from Emu" mined http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emu http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&channel=s&rls=org.mozilla %3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=642&q=hatshepsut+green+gold&btnG=Search&meta= Where did Tutankhamen get his boomerangs from Boomerang - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia King Tutankhamun, the famous Pharaoh of ancient Egypt, who died over 3000 years ago, owned a collection of boomerangs of both the straight flying (hunting) .. WHERE was he planning to live in the afterlife ??? . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boomerang . http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&channel=s&rls=org.mozilla :en-US:official&hs=bRi&q=tutankhamun%20boomerangs&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dcgk9t7p_39g56bfkf4&hl=en KANGAROO ISLAND - AN ARCHAEOLOGICAL MYSTERY When Europeans first saw Kangaroo Island it was uninhabited. Mainland Aborigines called it 'Karta' - Land of the Dead. We now know that Aborigines had lived on the island until at least 4,000 years ago - long after the island was isolated from the mainland by rising sea levels. Who were the Aborigines of Kangaroo Island? . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronze_Age_collapse Robert Drews describes the collapse as "the worst disaster in ancient history, even more calamitous than the collapse of the Western Roman Empire".[4] A number of people have spoken of the cultural memories of the disaster as stories of a "lost golden age". Hesiod for example spoke of Ages of Gold, Silver and Bronze, separated from the modern harsh cruel world of the Age of Iron by the Age of Heroes. [edit] Nature and causes of destruction As part of the Late Bronze Age-Early Iron Age Dark Ages, it was a period associated with the collapse of central authorities, a general depopulation, particularly of highly urban areas, the loss of literacy in Anatolia and the Aegean, and its restriction elsewhere, the disappearance of established patterns of long-distance international trade, increasingly vicious intra-elite struggles for power, and reduced options for the elite if not for the general mass of population. Who left these tools in south Australia 3200 years ago http://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=dcgk9t7p_12g2xp5tdk&hl=en http://picasaweb.google.com/kangarooistan9/KangarooistanOldIronToolProofTurinPap yrusGoldMineIsInSouthAustraliaTestImages# |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2010 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.