History Forum / General / British History / March 2008

[top posting corrected so that we can get
some logical order in this thread]

[genealogical groups spared]

Or, in the less emotive words of the Oxford Guide to English Usage,
page 171:

"Beware of introducing the objective _whomever_ incorrectly, as in _A
black mark for whomever it was that ordered the verges to be shorn
(Daily Telegraph)_.

Note that this is different from the rule in good English concerning
objects occurring before _who_. Here's what The Oxford Guide to
English Usage (1994) says on page 191:

"_He who_ and _she who_ are correctly used when _he_ and _she_ are the
subject of the main clause, and _who_ is the subject of the relative
clause:

    He who hesitates is lost.

_He who_ and _she who_ should not be treated as invariable. They
should change to _him who_ and _her who_ if the personal pronouns are
not the subject of the main clause:

    The distinction between the man who gives with conviction
    and him (not he) who is simply buying a title."

Lots of people have trouble with this. I've seen idiots who claim that
the standard English rule is "mistakenly using German grammar on the
English language". The only defence of this absurd claim that I have
seen is the argument that the person defending the standard usage is
an "ignorant, tyro, fat troglodyte, pseudo-grammarian".

The correct usage of subject and object forms is neatly illustrated in
Matthew 7:8:

"he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be
opened."

To some people, sadly, the difference beween subject and object will
always remain a closed door.

James

And so he avoids the question....demonstrating his ignorance.