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Was Nixon really the worst abuser of the Presidential Office? Was his     regime the most corrupt?

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RSF Group - 24 Jun 2008 03:17 GMT
In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat Buchanan and
Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell,  the latter accused Buchanan of having
stayed silent during the Nixon years when all sorts of rules were
being violated. But, Lawrence is missing the point. Buchanan was
consistent in sticking with the President during and after Nixon's
time in office.   Loyalty is not the only nor the highest virtue, but
it is a virtue.  McClellan, on the other hand, stayed mum as press
secretary though shocked and appalled by what he saw, and then ratted
on the whole administration once out of office--especially in an
election year.   He was a coward while serving the President and a
turncoat once out of office. There is no honor in this whatsoever.  If
he really felt that strongly while serving in the White House, he
should have spoken up. If he stayed mum out of loyalty, he should have
remained loyal.  But,  he just comes across as a coward and a rat--
also a pig trying to cash in on a book deal.
McClellan and Buchanan aside, was the Nixon presidency the 'most
corrupt' in US history as O'Donnell claims? No, that would be the
Clinton presidency where Bill and Hillary Clinton accepted bribes from
the Red Chinese government. Imagine that, the president of America
taking cash from a communist-run nation that would come to rival the
United States in the 21st Century. Also, the Kennedy and Johnson
administration had their share of crooks, influence peddlers, and
thieves. They just received more cover because the liberal media loved
them much--at least until Vietnam War turned the media against
Johnson.

When it comes to vice-presidents, FDR had, by far, the worst--before
replacement by Truman.  Henry Wallace was not an official Soviet agent
but might as well have been.   He was an ardent communist sympathizer
and admirer of mass murderer Stalin.  Had FDR died prior to replacing
Wallace with Truman, US would have come under the control of a closet-
communist. JUST IMAGINE THAT!  FDR was a very sick man thru the 40s
and could have died at any moment, and the US could come under the
rule of an American Lenin.  Imagine Wallace the Soviet admirer working
with people like Alger Hiss who was indeed a Soviet spy. They would
have worked together to bring in more closet-communists. They would
have used legal and extra-legal means to consolidate more power to
undermine democratic processes so as hog all the power. They would
have done what Allende attemped and what Hugo Chavez is attempting
now. That would have been the REAL 'plot against America'--but Jewish
author Philip Roth would have believe that US was in greater danger of
falling into the hands of Nazis and their sympathizers.  Of course,
had the American President during the 30s and 40s been an ailing
Republican whose vice-president had been a Nazi-sympathizer, whose
Secretary of State had been a Nazi spy, and whose administration was
teeming with Nazi agents, THEN one could argue US came alarmingly
close to falling under fascist dictatorship. But, the opposite was
true. FDR was in power, Wallace-as-vice-president was a Soviet
sympathizer, Alger Hiss was a communist spy, and the government was
teeming with Soviet agents.  So, American history just barely dodged a
Red bullet.  What FDR did to Japanese-Americans might have happened to
many more Americans in a Gulag States of America.
Spiro Agnew was a crook and a bum but not an evil person.  He was a
bumbler, a Greek-American version of Lyndon Johnson who excelled at
under-the-table machinations and backhanded deals. But, Agnew was
still an American patriot.  Wallace was a worshipper of Stalin, and
under his Presidency American government would have been crawling with
Soviet agents and American communists, a good number of which had
already made significant inroads under FDR.

But, most ridiculous of all is the notion that Watergate represents
the GREATEST and MOST SHAMEFUL abuse of presidential power in US
history.   Yes, it was bad and those involved got their just desserts.
And perhaps it was necessary that Nixon too had to relinquish power.
But, it was essentially a case of boys-gone-wild than an attempt to
banish democracy and liberties from America--what would have happened
under Wallace.  Nixon hired the so-called Plumbers because the illegal
leaks had to plugged. He put them to work, and well, you know, 'boys
will be boys'. If a scoutmaster tells his scouts to go out and bring
back a perch, they'll bring back 10 perches and an alligatgor snapping
turtle. If he tells them to bring back a rabbit, they'll bring back a
deer. Nixon told them boys to use their tools to stop the leaks, and
they went and used the tools to unlock doors. They did bad stuff, and
it was nasty. They got their comeuppance. Did Nixon order the break-
in?  I'm 50/50 on this and perhaps we'll never know.  But, was
Watergate really the worst abuse of Presidential authority?

Let us suppose that Nixon did order or knew about the break-in. Would
it still have been worse than what Wilson or FDR did?  During WWI,
Wilson threw a lot of people in jail and suspended basic liberties.
FDR went even further and dispossessed/imprisoned over 150,000
Japanese-Americans.  You mean to tell me that the Watergate Break-in
was a greater breachment of Presidential powers than throwing anti-war
protesters in jail or confiscating the property and imprisoning an
entire population of American citizens based on ethnicity?
Now, all liberals will say that Nixon deserved to be impeached and
convicted for what he did. Do they feel the same way about Wilson and
FDR? Should Wilson have been impeached and convicted for his actions
during WWI? Should FDR have been impeached and convicted for what he
did to Japanese-Americans during WWII?  Sure, both Wilson and FDR did
what they did under the moral cover of war, but so did Nixon.  US was
in the middle of Vietnam War which was a part of the larger Cold War.
Also, Nixon faced far greater anti-war protests than Wilson and FDR
combined during WWI and WWII.  Yet, how many people did Nixon throw in
jail?  Sure, he compiled an 'enemy list' but Big Deal! Is that worse
than throwing war protesters in jail like Wilson had done?  At the
very least, Wilson locked people up based on their words and actions.
And, he didn't dispossess them nor target entire families. FDR
dispossessed and locked up over 150,000 Americans--man, woman,
grampies, and children--who didn't protest the war, didn't give
comfort to the enemy, didn't subvert the war effort.  They were
dispossessed and locked up simply because of their ethnicity out of
fear that Japanese-Americans would try to subvert the war effor. But,
in fact, far more Jewish Americans spied for the enemy--namely the
USSR--than Japanese-Americans ever did.

Of course, one could say that though Wilson and FDR did some terrible
things, we must balance their misdeeds with the good/great things they
did. Then, the same thing can be said of Nixon.  He tried to work with
liberals, tried to further social change, and tried to create a safer
world thru agreements with USSR and rapproachment with China.  Yet,
all of Nixon's achievements have been ignored or overshadowed by
WATERGATE, WATERGATE, WATERGATE.  But, as nasty and stupid as
Watergate was, can it compare with what Wilson or FDR did?   Suppose
FDR's underlings had broken in at a GOP headquarters while Nixon,
fearful of Asian and Jewish subversion during the Vietnam War, had
ordered the dispossession and imprisonment of all Asian- and Jewish-
Americans. Would historians--mostly liberal--say that FDR's cover-up
of his underlings' misdeed was a greater abuse of Presidential power
than Nixon's? Somehow, I don't think so.

American history is written by liberal and leftist historians, and the
political bias really shows.  Indeed, it reeks in every history book
and discussion. Not long ago, a discussion on Alger Hiss only invited
those who believed in his innocence. Because Nixon hated liberal
intellectuals, liberal intellectuals think even a relatively minor
misdeed by Nixon was much greater and graver sin than truly terrible
crimes of Wilson and FDR. Liberal historians accuse Nixon of being
petty, bitter, and vengeful, but liberal historians are no better.
Nixon has always been on THEIR Enemies List. Even Nixon's molehill of
misdeeds is somehow worse than Wilson or FDR's mountain of sins.

But, this is to be expected from a liberal(and Jewish)dominated media
and academia that still makes a far bigger deal of McCarthyism than
over FDR's suppression of anti-war voices and the imprisonment of
Japanese-Americans. Historians and journalists even collude by using
'internment' without quotes. Japanese-Americans were not 'interned'.
They were IMPRISONED. They were dispossessed and imprisoned in
concentration or prison camps. To be sure, they were not maltreated
like victims in the Soviet gulag or Nazi labor camps. Nor, were they
used for slave labor. But, it was imprisonment, not 'internment'.
Suppose a million Jewish-Americans were dispossessed and herded
together into a vast prison camp. Would liberal Jews call that
'internment' than 'imprisonment'?  Of course, the Japanese-Americans
were not kept in individual cells, but neither were POWs and those in
the gulag--or even in the Nazi death camps. But, a prison camp is a
prison camp. And, it's outrage that it's still referred to as an
'internment camp' or written in history books that Japanese-Americans
were 'interned'. They were robbed of all their savings and property
and imprisoned.

So, what was the greater crime of Presidential authority? Nixon's
Watergate scandal OR  Wilson's imprisoning of anti-war folks or FDR's
imprisonment of Japanese-Americans who committed no crime whatsoever?
What was a greater abuse of Presidential power? Using one's authority
to cover up a bumbled break-in by underlings or using one's authority
to lock up conscientious protestors or dispossess/imprison an entire
population which had been loyal?

To be sure, we can argue that both Wilson and FDR did it under the
cover of 'legality'. They got the Congress and the judiciary to go
along--and the populace supported or didn't much oppose those actions.
In contrast, Watergate, though small potatoes in comparison, was done
under the cover of darkness. FDR declared, "I'm gonna steal all the
cookies from Japanese-Americans" and had the whole nation go along
with his criminal attack on the constitution. So, he could say he was
no more guilty than Congress, the courts, and the American people.  In
contrast, it really seemed to the American public that Nixon got
caught with his hands in the cookie jar. Nixon got caught stealing a
single cookie, but it was manner than the nature of the crime that
really destroyed him. FDR was far more clever and devious in abusing
his presidential authority. He made it seem 'legal' and
'constitutional' with the collusion of other branches of government.

The way we remember history--which is to say what liberals and
leftists remember for us thru their control of the media and academia--
should prove once and for all the totally bogus nature of liberal
history. They are nothing but a bunch of partisan crooks.

Anyway, John McCain says Obama's presidency would be Jimmy Carter's
second term. That wouldn't be so bad. The real danger is Obama's may
well be the first term of Henry Wallace. Like Wallace, Obama is a
closet-radical with Marxist leanings and reveres people like Fidel
Castro.  Also, Obama has had close ties with far-left figures like
Bill Ayers and virulently anti-American figures like Khalidi.  And,
someone should draw a cartoon of the lapdog media around Obama. The
media, which is supposed to be the watchdog of American politics, are
wagging their tails and bowing down before Obama. Why? It's dominated
by liberals and leftists who want an American Castro in power.  Obama
has long mastered the art of passing as a 'non-threatening negro' in
white society. Now, he's trying to pass as a fellow American when he's
really an arrogant and bitter radical opportunist.
BibsBro - 24 Jun 2008 03:23 GMT
> In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat Buchanan and
> Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell,  the latter accused Buchanan of having
[quoted text clipped - 188 lines]
> white society. Now, he's trying to pass as a fellow American when he's
> really an arrogant and bitter radical opportunist.

N othing sank is low as the Clinton adminisration. Even Democrats chose an
inexperienced unqualified candidate as their nominee as opposed to a third
term of Clinton sleazy gov't.
Mitchell Holman - 24 Jun 2008 03:30 GMT
"BibsBro" <BibsBro@taxachusetts.com> wrote in news:_O6dnZiH2YRqx_
3VnZ2dnUVZ_o7inZ2d@supernews.com:

> Nothing sank is low as the Clinton adminisration. Even Democrats chose an
> inexperienced unqualified candidate as their nominee as opposed to a third
> term of Clinton sleazy gov't.

   It is always fun to see the defenders
of Bush and Reagan talk about "inexperienced
candidates".
BibsBro - 24 Jun 2008 03:30 GMT
> "BibsBro" <BibsBro@taxachusetts.com> wrote in news:_O6dnZiH2YRqx_
> 3VnZ2dnUVZ_o7inZ2d@supernews.com:
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> of Bush and Reagan talk about "inexperienced
> candidates".

Really? Why?
Joe Bruno - 24 Jun 2008 04:01 GMT
> In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat Buchanan and
> Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell,  the latter accused Buchanan of having
[quoted text clipped - 158 lines]
>
> read more »...

By all accounts, Grant's administration was very corrupt.
Grant, himself was not crooked, but he was very trusting and people
took advantage of him.
BibsBro - 24 Jun 2008 04:02 GMT
On Jun 23, 7:17 pm, RSF Group <aegisi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat Buchanan and
> Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell, the latter accused Buchanan of having
[quoted text clipped - 158 lines]
>
> read more »...

By all accounts, Grant's administration was very corrupt.
Grant, himself was not crooked, but he was very trusting and people
took advantage of him.

______________________________

That's interesting. What kind of things did they do?
Joe Bruno - 24 Jun 2008 04:29 GMT
> On Jun 23, 7:17 pm, RSF Group <aegisi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 168 lines]
>
> That's interesting. What kind of things did they do?

Read this:

http://ap.grolier.com/article?assetid=0182800-00
BibsBro - 24 Jun 2008 04:30 GMT
On Jun 23, 8:02 pm, "BibsBro" <Bibs...@taxachusetts.com> wrote:
> "Joe Bruno" <jbr...@indystart.com> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 171 lines]
>
> That's interesting. What kind of things did they do?

Read this:

http://ap.grolier.com/article?assetid=0182800-00

______________________________

Thanks!
Joe Bruno - 24 Jun 2008 04:34 GMT
> On Jun 23, 8:02 pm, "BibsBro" <Bibs...@taxachusetts.com> wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 181 lines]
>
> Thanks!

Ni stoit!(that's "Don't mention it" for you non-Russkies)
Kurt Knoll - 24 Jun 2008 04:20 GMT
I let you figure it out. When Richard Nixon did move into the Whitehouse
after looking around. He said to JR Halderman just look around you theses
are all Jews meaning the Whitehouse staff. What do you think the reason was
for saying this. PS there in Iraq was a war for Israel. The question now
only is what will the next American President say when America attacks Iran.
Kurt Knoll.

On Jun 23, 7:17 pm, RSF Group <aegisi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat Buchanan and
> Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell, the latter accused Buchanan of having
[quoted text clipped - 158 lines]
>
> read more »...

By all accounts, Grant's administration was very corrupt.
Grant, himself was not crooked, but he was very trusting and people
took advantage of him.
Lars Braesicke - 24 Jun 2008 18:57 GMT
> I let you figure it out.

Knolle, thou old trübe tasse!
Thou speakest again not in the German tongue in a German language
newsgroup.
Is this too difficult for thee, alte Puppe?
Why canst thou not stop thy silly X-posting, old fuckhead?
Art thou völlig blöde?

Lars
PseuDoeCyAnts - 24 Jun 2008 06:01 GMT
on Mon 23 Jun 2008 07:17:12p
RSF Group <aegisigea@hotmail.com> posted
in
news:c6d246c7-58e2-4e5e-a320-
9db3a20fac5e@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups
.com:

> In a recent debate on Scott McClellan's book between Pat
> Buchanan and Lawrence Rosie O'Donnell,  the latter accused
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> across as a coward and a rat-- also a pig trying to cash in on a
> book deal.

What an amusing piece of tripe.

Pat Buchanan loyal Nixon foot-soldier,
and Nixon brutally used him as a tool.

Buchanan recommended that Nixon knife J. Edgar Hoover in the back.
Nixon, understanding politics well, and amused as hell, instead
decided to use Buchanan's crazed vehement ravenings to sow
distrust within his own administration, as a method for securing
loaylty, through paranoia; a classic Nixon strategy.

-------------------------------------------
-- begin Nixon tape transcript --

Nixon and Haldeman Discussing
the Ouster of J. Edgar Hoover Transcript

February 18, 1971
Conversation Oval Office 451-12
1:20 P.M. to 2:32 P.M.

H.R. "Bob" Haldeman: I got an interesting piece from
   [White House speechwriter] Pat Buchanan that says while it
   may be unorthodox coming from him, he thinks you should
   replace Mr. Hoover as soon as possible, for his good, for
   our good, and for the country’s good.

President Nixon: That’s interesting.

Haldeman: He wants us to be preemptive about it. Pat’s
   saying that, you know, he’s past the peak of his esteem.
   At one point he would get us-95 percent of the nation felt
   he was doing a phenomenal job; he now has nowhere-he has
   had nowhere to go but down; and he is going down steadily.
   He can’t reverse the trend; the attacks on him are
   mounting, and the deterioration in his standing with the
   nation in, you know, the face of the. [tape skips] [His
   own place in history] is secure, but with each of these
   new battles in which he involves himself it’s being
   sullied. He stands today with the American people as an
   unvarnished symbol of what’s right with law enforcement.
   He must retire in a matter of a few years anyhow, and it
   would be better for his symbol and his place in history to
   get out now.

President Nixon: Hmm. He’s right-

Haldeman: Second, he’s under terrific heat, and instead of
   his former practice of ignoring his critics, he’s
   responding, which is just what they want.

President Nixon: Yeah.

Haldeman: And he’s not totally right on these battles. He
   comes out as a reactionary. Young people don’t have any
   esteem for him. He’s becoming a villain; and he’s tied
   totally to us. [Democratic political hopeful Senator
   George] McGovern is making him a focal point of attack,
   which is certain to continue. And on one of these issues
   someday, one’s gonna guess, the public is gonna think
   Hoover’s wrong and McGovern’s right. Then he says,
   finally, if Hoover goes now he can be retired in full
   glory at a time of his own choosing. If we wait, it’ll be
   something like the departure of General Hershey, which had
   all the appearances of a forced departure.

President Nixon: Yeah.

Haldeman: Then he adds finally we want our man in the job
   before ’72, ’cause the [Associate Supreme Court Justice
   Abe] Fortas-like the Fortas thing became an issue
   [unclear-overlapping voices]. President Nixon: Yeah, yeah,
   he’s absolutely right. He just couldn’t be more right.

[Tape skips]

Haldeman: [reading] ["My strong recommendation would be to
   retire Hoover now] in all the glory and esteem he has
   merited and deserved; and not letting him-for his own sake
   and ours-wind up his career a dead lion being chewed over
   by the jackals of the Left."

President Nixon: Absolutely right, Bob, absolutely right.
   Well, let’s put that to [Attorney General John] Mitchell.
   That it’s not from me, but from Buchanan. Let’s play this
   game [unclear]: From one of our-from a very surprising
   source on the far-on the right.

Haldeman: On the right.

President Nixon: On the far right, and I . . . one of our
   . . . why not, say, put one of our . . . put one of our
   favorite columnists on the far right. He will never write
   it. He will be confused about it.

-- end Nixon tape transcript --
-----------------------------------------------------------
Sanders Kaufman - 25 Jun 2008 01:18 GMT
> There is no honor in this whatsoever.  If
> he really felt that strongly while serving in the White House, he
> should have spoken up. If he stayed mum out of loyalty, he should have
> remained loyal.  But,  he just comes across as a coward and a rat--
> also a pig trying to cash in on a book deal.

He did the RIGHT thing.
Speaking against the president WHILE serving as press secretary would have
been wrong.
Instead, he quit his job as Bush's mouthpiece and came clean.
Then, when called to testify, he testified.

That's not just the RIGHT thing to do - it's the CHRISTIAN thing to do.
 
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